Mindy Thomas

Career Chat – Mindy Thomas Interviews Randy Lumia

 

Mindy Thomas:

Hi everyone. I’m Mindy Thomas, and this is career chat. We are on air every Monday at 11:30 and Tuesday nights at 8:00 pm. Our topic today is all about human resources and I have a very special guest who has more than 30 years as a human resource specialist and executive. He has worked with companies on a global basis. He is currently the SVP of People, Culture and Organizational Effectiveness, Avatar Airlines, a startup airline coming out of Jupiter, Florida. Welcome to the show, Randy.

Randy Lumia:

Good morning, Mindy. How are you doing?

Mindy Thomas:

Great. I am so excited to talk to you about an organization that is hiring, but no less a company that starts up an airline in the middle of COVID.

Randy Lumia:

You know, it’s a good question. That’s when we get quite often these days and, you know, there could not be probably a better time. We’re benefiting from the unfortunate circumstances of the pandemic, with COVID-19 obviously we will hear of all the problems that the airlines are having. And they’ve been subject to a lot of funding from the government in terms of stimulus funding. Even with that, they’re hurting very badly because people are just not traveling. And as a result, many of those planes have been grounded and many of those businesses are, are hurting. And, probably a good number of them will need to seek bankruptcy protection and other things. But for us right now we are debt-free, we’re not flying yet. We anticipate flying in about 18 months to 24 months, approximately, which is about how long does it take for the approval process.

Randy Lumia:

So by the time we are ready to fly, we will probably be the only debt-free airline in the world. So that’s the first thing. The second thing is we will have an abundance of planes to choose from in terms of the ability to purchase planes on the used market to start the airline up and third, and one of the most important things for me is the availability of labor. Unfortunately, many of these airlines are being forced to reduce their staff. We’ve heard upwards of 80,000 people are going to be losing jobs. And in the third quarter, into the fourth quarter, again, as a result of people’s lack of travel so that’s going to be an unfortunate circumstance for them, but a very fortunate circumstance for us. So we’ll have the availability of people. We’ll have the availability of the actual aircraft and we will be debt-free. Those are three really good reasons why to start an airline. 

Mindy Thomas:

It’s really an amazing idea. We’re talking Spirit Airlines, and Frontier. So is this a no-frills type of airline? I mean, are the seats going to be so hard that I can’t take it to fly to Vegas for five hours? Like on Spirit? I’m sorry, I just can’t.

Randy Lumia:

Yeah, we’ve heard that quite often. Now we will be a low-cost high volume airline. We are built on the premise of using the Boeing 747, which as many of you probably realize many of your listeners realize that it’s an aircraft that’s been retired because it’s deemed to be inefficient. There are newer aircraft that are more efficient and many airlines are stopping using them. They were primarily used for international travel. We intend to use these Queens of the sky as they are referred to for large volume areas here in the US. So we’re looking at high volume markets like New York, Miami, LA, Las Vegas, et cetera, to take people from these, long destinations where they hope to be a little bit more comfortable than in those smaller seats that you’re talking about.

Mindy Thomas:

Thank you so much, Randy. I am interested in the title of your role, the SVP of People, Culture and Organizational Effectiveness. It’s the title for a King. I know you’ve had an incredible career. You’re a powerhouse. It’s fantastic. So did you create the title and why?

Randy Lumia:

It actually evolved as a result of what’s going to be important in the Avatar airline business. The airline business and Avatar specifically are nothing without its people. You know, many airlines in many businesses have always professed to say that their most important asset is people. We intend to prove that and show that. The second component of that title is culture. You know, there was a little airline called Southwest Airlines that people said it’ll never work. You guys are crazy. You’re nuts. You can’t operate like that. It’s so unorthodox. Well, we’re going to be very unorthodox as well. Not only in the way that we operate, the way that we act, and the way that we treat our employees, our vendors, and our passengers.

Randy Lumia:

So, that’s the second major component and organizational effectiveness. It’s nice to be good to people. It’s nice to be good to employees. It’s nice to have a strong culture, but you also have to be focused on the bottom line of why it is that you’re doing what you’re doing and that you are there to run a business. But you can do it in a way that is not only profitable but you make sure employees are happy about the place they work and that makes the passengers happy about the choice of flying Avatar. So it is a long title, but there were rhyme and reason behind that title.

Mindy Thomas:

Well, it intersects all the things that accompany needs, right? A good culture, great people, and an organization that produces what they say that they’re going to deliver. So I have a question for you. What is a global HR executive with a powerhouse of a background that you come from with credentials up the ying-yang, the master’s degree, everything, and, and including, an engineering degree, why are you so attracted to HR? I wonder what drew you to that in your career over the tenure of your career, and also, what do you look for in your new hires?

Randy Lumia:

You know, easy question, hard answer, but, it would take about six or seven strong drinks to go through the whole evolution, but there is a rhyme and reason to what I originally chose engineering when I was in college. It was more on the technical side, in the area of electrical and mechanical, and I just found it to be very impersonal. But then I got into industrial engineering, which involved dialogue and interactions with, the people on the floor, the people in manufacturing, the people in, in all aspects of the business. So I chose that as a reason. So I was a people person. I joined, a pharmaceutical company in manufacturing as an engineer and supervisor, and that evolved into a training role, where I did technical and regulatory training. But then I also started doing leadership development, and it just kinda morphed from an operational role to training into the more traditional HR realm. So there was a rhyme or reason to how I got there, but it was a, it was a long road. It was not linear for sure. No, and probably unorthodox by any means. But, I like to think that that has helped me to think differently, and has made me what I hope to be successful and why I think I add value. I do look at things a little bit more non-traditional.

Mindy Thomas:

Well, you have a beautiful intersection of being, having the analytical skills and the technical skills, and also the people skills and that intersect so beautifully with, your background. And so when you’re looking for new hires today, how can you help our listeners understand what’s really important? What has to come across in that zoom interview and on the resume for you to pick up the phone and say, hey, I’d like to talk to you.

Randy Lumia:

You know, I’m getting this question a lot these days, Mindy, especially in light of the situation that the world’s faced over the last nine, 10 months. Interviewing itself has changed enormously. Most interviews now are done via zoom or remotely, you know, on the phone, very few face to face interviews anymore. People have to understand that they need to make themselves different from everybody else. I mean, that’s probably not different so much, in interviews over the past, but the way that you really need to shine these days is to show how you can operate or how you can take an unfortunate situation and make it beneficial to yourself or to the company. You know, whether it means in our case, you know, we actually think the pandemic as unfortunate as it is for the world and for the health of, of many people, it’s actually an advantage to what we’re trying to do.

Randy Lumia:

And the same case can be made with any candidate. You know, a lot of times people are asked, do you know, what could you have done differently? You need to show how you take the initiative to make good from potentially a bad situation. I think that’s probably one of the most important things that candidates can do. You know I’m for people that take the initiative to do things, people that don’t want to be told what to do. When I look at a resume, 75 to 80% of what an individual can do on their resume, they can actually do, so then it becomes down to organizational fit and the ability for that employee or that candidate to take what they’ve already used and apply it in a way that’s proactive. That’s really what I’m looking for. 

Mindy Thomas:

When you talk about the culture, what, what is the culture going to be for Avatar Airlines and why the name Avatar. I think of the movie Avatar.

Randy Lumia:

From Disney? Yeah. You know, an avatar is something that’s bigger than life, which, you know, really fits what we’re, what we’re all about, you know, avatar and the fact that we using a 747, one of the largest planes flying the skies, it’s known as the queen of the skies. There’s a reason that they were called Avatar. You know, it’s grabbing what people think is not possible and making it possible. So when you talk about things like culture, the fact that Avatar is the name, I think is indicative of a lot of what we’re trying to do. You know, we have a CEO, his name is Barry Michaels. One of the things he really challenges everybody to do is thinking outside of the box, just be Chris. This is the way that an airline may have operated, or this is a way of business that may have operated. What can we do differently? What, how could we make it better? How can we make it more efficient? Can we make it safer? It’s always the questioning of, you know, differentiating yourself from the competition and former competitors. 

Mindy Thomas:

Hi, everyone. If you’re just joining, joining us, we are back with Randy Lumina of, of Avatar Airlines. He’s the Senior Vice President of People, Culture and Organizational Effectiveness. Randy, welcome back. We were talking about your culture and Avatar Airlines, a startup airline that’s launching in about 18 months. It’s going to be a competitor to all those low-cost airlines that are flying around. What are the distinctions about the kind of culture that you’re hiring into?

Randy Lumia:

No, it’s a good question because, you know, as I mentioned earlier, we’re going to benefit from COVID with the availability of labor. We are actually looking at some employees that are either currently employed or will not be employed by airlines, but just because you’re with the airlines, doesn’t make you a natural candidate for a position in Avatar. Because again, when we look at culture, we were looking at how people are going to do their jobs. We know you probably could do certain jobs within the aviation world, but it’s how you do them. I mean, we’ve all been on a plane where a flight attendant does what they’re supposed to do, but they have a little bit of an attitude or an edge to him that know just perhaps doesn’t sit. Right? We’ve all seen that and we need to find ways to differentiate our employees from others and that’s going to be how they do their job. So it’s going to be an important aspect of any candidate profile that we look out for when we bring them in.

Mindy Thomas:

So there’s an assessment process that goes on. What kind of tools will you be using? Will there be formal assessment tools?

Randy Lumia:

Not at this point. We may, in the future, we are considering it. We are going to be looking at the recruiting process again, very differently than perhaps many of the airlines have looked at in the past. We have professionals in our organization that come from all different industries, not only aviation. So we hope to benefit from the best traits from the route industry, not just from the aviation world

Mindy Thomas:

And Randy, what kind of positions are you hiring for? So if we have listeners out there and they’re unemployed, or they’re semi-retired or they’re retired and they really want to do something, could you name some of the titles that are available and where do people apply for a job with avatar airlines?

Randy Lumia:

Good question. Our positions will be located on our website, which is very simply AvatarAirlines.com. We are looking for all types of positions, even non-aviation positions, for instance, we have positions open in finance, we’ll have positions opening facilities, we’ll have positions open in marketing sales. You know, all of the traditional staff functions you might think of in a business Avatar will have as well. So we’ll also have, of course, those positions as flight attendants and pilots, and such, but all the positions will be on the website as we look to hire them. But just don’t think because you’re not in the aviation world, you’re not qualified, you couldn’t be more mistaken. We’re looking for people with the best skillsets.

Mindy Thomas:

How about technical people, you know that used to work as a copier technician say that used to work as an administrative assistant for a college or university, or you’re in retail sales at Nordstrom right now. And you want out, is there a place for people like that?

Randy Lumia:

Absolutely. Oh, we’re actually toying with the idea of hiring flight attendants that may have absolutely no experience and kind of treat them, you know, train them on what it is we’re expecting from them in that role. So there’s going to be a lot of opportunity for people that may not have the skillsets that they think they need for the various positions. Again, what’s going to differentiate them is how they look about doing a job. You know, if, if you’re taking the advantages of looking outside of what your comfort zone is that might be a benefit, you know, people that are going to stretch themselves to look for a job are probably going to be stretching themselves in the job once they get it. So, you know, it’s all about how you do what it is that you do.

Mindy Thomas:

Great. It’s about work ethic. It’s just not like, Oh, you’re going to show up. You, you need to show up a hundred percent. And that’s the kind of folks that you’re looking for. So if someone in Philadelphia wants to apply for a job with Avatar, does that mean they need to move down to Jupiter, Florida or Boca Raton?

Randy Lumia:

Absolutely not. Right now, to be quite honest, we are a virtual organization. We have employees working and living and working in California,  the upper peninsula of Michigan, here in Florida, we have people in, in Pennsylvania, and New York City. We’re all over the country and we use technology in which to communicate.

Mindy Thomas:

What is your biggest challenge right now in recruiting people for Avatar Airlines? What would you say?

Randy Lumia:

I think that the biggest challenge is to first educate, candidates to the very first question you had, you know, how could you even think about starting an airline and you have to get people comfortable with now’s the best time. So it’s really getting over that hump of what it is we’re trying to do. And when you educate them and they see that, you know, as you peel back the onion and you kind of sell to them what our business model is, you’re going to say, I want a piece of this. You know, being part of a startup operation doesn’t happen quite often in many people’s careers. And once you do it, you’re kind of hooked. And, you know, it’s a lot of work, but there’s a lot of gratification in doing that work. So we like to use the term that it becomes becoming infectious and that all the work that we’re doing and all the commitment is, and it’s contagious and we’re feeding on that. And it’s just a great thing to say.

Mindy Thomas:

I’m certainly looking forward to flying on Avatar because, and I’d like you to explain to the viewers, once again, your Avatar has seven 747, they’re the queen of the skies. So when we’re looking at Southwest, Frontier, and Spirit Airlines, what are they flying?

Randy Lumia:

Well? I mean, they’re, I mean, they’re flying, you know, very similar, very similar routes. And the matter of fact, most of the them, I think most of those airlines are also dropping routes because they’re being forced to cut costs. You know, we’re going to be going from zero to adding routes. Now, I mean, most of our routes are going to begin with, again in the high volume areas between New York, Miami, LA, Las Vegas, Orlando. That’s, that’s our year one, projections year two and three, expand to other major markets like Chicago and others. But we are going to primarily be operating on, you know, the higher volume routes, that can better capable of filling, you know, 747, which we’ll see in our case, it’ll sit approximately 583 people. That’s a lot of passengers.

Mindy Thomas:

And so will you incorporate the new safety protocols when you build out these airlines? So when we go and sit, or we were going to be right next to, you know, like sardines that we’re we’re right now experiencing when we fly, or are you building those planes with safety protocols?

Randy Lumia:

I mean, the, the thing about the 747 is it’s, it’s a big, big plane, as many of you who have flown it, know. You know, within the next year to 18 months, a lot is going to happen in the area of COVID prevention. And you know, many of the airlines right now are, are blocking the middle seat, et cetera. So a lot is still TBD in terms of what the actual comfort level and or safety level will be in terms of requirements from the FAA or others. But in a 747, we certainly have the space in which we, we, we could make those adjustments based on what the requirements are going to be to meet, those goals. So we have more flexibility than most airlines in terms of the aircraft in which we will do.

Mindy Thomas:

Okay, great. I’m curious about whether your company is using an applicant tracking system. So do people need to have the right keywords? Cause like if I was and I have written for an airline someone who wanted to be a flight attendant had to use the proper keywords and competencies within that resume. Is your company also using ATS systems to scan for keywords and competencies or not?

Randy Lumia:

We are not using an applicant tracking system for the purpose of identifying candidates. We are tracking candidates as it’s required by, you know, regulatory compliance, for applicant tracking. But, we are in the process of identifying all systems that are going be required for the Avatar business. That includes an HRS system with a, with a recruiting application in it, it’s a reservation system. We’re looking at its safety management system. So all of our IT systems are actually currently being evaluated to determine which are the best for the money that we can have in terms of purchasing and using. But in terms of the candidates right now, it’s a hundred percent visual screen people actually physically reading these things. So it’s really important to have your resume stand out from others by highlighting those things that you want the reader to read very early in the resume.

Mindy Thomas:

Okay. So like we get 6.5 seconds to impress you and what needs to jump out distinctions about what people need to have there. It seems to me people-oriented customer-focused,  technical skills, other things that you would be looking for, Randy?

Randy Lumia:

You know, that’s an interesting question. And one of the things that I personally look for, you can tell from a resume, if somebody is using the word I more so than we and our taking credit, perhaps for efforts that were a result of a group effort, you know, those that are in it for themselves need not apply. You know, we are looking for, again, those that are more comfortable and more productive working in an environment that’s collaborative in nature, and that’s going to be really team-based and that’s where our focus is.

Mindy Thomas:

Huge. Well, Randy, I have a lot of people to send to you and I can’t wait, to get on the phone and send them over to your website. Please tell everyone where they can apply for a job at Avatar Airlines. And if they wanted to reach you, should they go to LinkedIn? Should they send you an email? Tell us how to find you.

Randy Lumia:

Good question. We do have a website again, it’s avatarairlines.com.  There is a career page you will see, and you’ll also see biographies of our current staff. I am also absolutely on LinkedIn, and I’m a strong believer and advocate for LinkedIn as a too not only for looking for a job but for networking and just to find out what the rest of the world is doing.

Mindy Thomas:

Well, Randy, thank you so much for making time here at RVN for my audience. We really appreciate your time and I’m so glad you’re hiring and you have a lot of energy and enthusiasm about this new launch, and I am excited for you. I’m going to be pulling and rooting for you. So thank you again, Randy. It’s been a pleasure. My pleasure, also, my viewing audience. I am so happy you stopped by today. We will be coming back to you. I am relocating to Las Vegas, Nevada, but we will be shooting from location and also back in Philadelphia in the next few months. So stay tuned and thanks for stopping by. Remember your careers, your business, it’s time you started managing it like you’re the CEO take care. Bye bye.